OMG MP! Nah, im too busy playing my level 18 ER to bother with a level 1 FR.
You may want to suicide Treyz, before he gets found out and nuked too. :)
I don't even know you:P
Yay, and stay gone! =)
You fucking computer nerds and your silly clients.
pounder your SKR-HUB, learn to read!
Shit, I just realized that Osse's tell down there was only pertaining to being level 23 and not a method of making gold etc. My bad. I was just rereading the thread.
Would this one have been unless a character account was leaked out or hacked, whatever happened to it? Probably not.
But, to my knowledge at least, they were never exposed to everybody on the mud.
Why is it such a bad thing? Plenty of Guilds, and groups of players, maintain lists of alternate characters. I used to. The Thieves do, and so do various cliques within FRA and the Meglivornth. It's probably been going on for as long as the MUD.
Good bye Mark.
Good luck and have fun with whatever you do in your life.
Seriously you dicks :) Its a lie, gilgoroth was not my alt.
I have the list as well :P
I've got pictures of the alt page. So, keep lying bucko!
Date: 20. Mar, 2008, 17:30:25 By: Delkin
The Durmanhoth website does not have alt lists. The Durmanhoth website is not public information. The Durmanhoth website requires a guild username as well as password. To access it, you must hack our website or use an account which you are not authorized to use.
See, it's that kind of disingenuous bullshit that hurts your public image. See, the Durmanhoth website does not have an alt list because you removed it a week ago, and only then because people saw that you had it and brought it to attention.
By wording it in that way you're trying to give the impression that people are just making this up. I've been to the site and I've read the alt info section.
Nope, I'm serious! If Durms get away with stuff that the rest of us wouldn't, it's not their fault. The people we should be mad at are the people holding the double standards, Valinor.
They're the ones that changed the rules. Durms just took advantage. Of course it's easier to get mad at Durms, they're not going to nuke you for calling them out on their bullshit.
Orcoron, that last paragraph of yours was very gay. But I'm going to assume you just want people to flame more :P Anyways, Delkin is a fucking tool and its hilarious listening to him trying to defend himself. You'd think they'd stop trying to spew their bullshit after they realized no one takes anything they say seriously.
Don't listen to him! I have work to grind through here.
Grahk, that was the funniest fucking thing I have seen on this log page, I just laughed out loud at fucking work and thank god almost everyone is gone! LOL. Manni is silent, he is still trying to figure out a way of how to spin this.
On a very serious note, I am going to talk to Aule or Osse tonight, this situation has gotten way out of hand. This entire thing is making EVERYONE look horrible and it is going downhill from what the community should be going for.
I am asking that all my friends and others that respect me to please drop from commenting on this thread for the sake of the game. This is not what we want people to have to come back to and think about when they think about Arda.
Best go back the way you came Jerkimer! Your kind ain't welcome 'round these here parts.
One MUD!
One Playerbase!
One PoL!
hi im grahk from herkimer, brandons brother gave haarni my password because i beat him at the spelling quiz and now im nuked im new to this game i just want to play and help newbies and have fun.
Yeah but I got my punishment for that:P Why let me max and then nuke me, Osse knew it was me from level 3!!!!! Damn those Internet Moderators!
Also, because you're a dope and you fall asleep with your bot on, making it really easy for them to pin it on you:P
Because Haarni, Stalinor is made up of people called 'Internet Moderators'.
I agreed with all you jsut said! But how come only I get hardbanned and nuked for it?:P
I have had one of my trademark changes of heart!
So what if Durms have their wiki thing with a client, alt into and quests on it? How is that different to what the rest of us do. We all tell our friends and guildmates about who we know/think people's alts are, we all share quest info with our guildmates and friends and there are a bunch of people out there using other people's clients!
And who cares if it's artificially propping up their newbies? It's actually a good thing. Because they haven't worked to really learn areas and practice skills their clients are pretty useless to them. And since everyone hates Durms, when their older and more experienced members go on to do something else and aren't as active, we can have the fun of slaughtering their newbies like pigs.
Also so what if Delkin is Dighi and he's making these really embarassing attempts to say he isn't? How many people that were hardbanned still play? Pretty sure Skyman was hardbanned at some point. Marthaon was hardbanned and nobody bats an eyelid if he logs in. Hell, Turin was fucking hardcorebanned.
Stalinor is the enemy here! They always have been and always will be!
13011
Holy shit! 13000 logs!!
More than Delkin, yeah :) (to Hurb)
http://logs.dyndns.dk/comments.php/12839
I couldn't bother finding the comment section where Delkin lied about his wizard alt, but this is one where he lies. (and I already said, I don't have anything against Kiviel using triggers to attack animals, it's Delkin's lies that I can't take)
Like you can talk guru... haarni
'If you use the client and it helps you survive attacks from newbie killers or helps you easily explore new areas'
Yeah, you've always struck me as the newbie loving type Dig.. Delkin.
Sweet. I get to read all of this at work...hope it's good!
Also, I could be serious and say that the 10-20 people who have and are using my client are not 'carrying a license' as well. I only gave 3 people permission to use it. And yes, it is my property.
However, I genuinely don't care. If you use the client and it helps you survive attacks from newbie killers or helps you easily explore new areas, then I accomplished my goal. Although it was meant for 3 of my guildmates and someone exploited the link, so what? It was meant to help new guys explore and come to love the land of Arda.
lol! No, I haven't :P
Evidently you've never been to Texas.
Also, Delkin, if you own a gun and walk around with it without a license, whether it is concealed or revealed, it is a crime. Period.
It's a good day for arda!
Not sure what that means, Delkin. I could post something from an old log of mine, and post what my (currently non-existing :p) client says now, too. Ooor, I could just make things up. Like, uhm, you do!
I remember for example when you claimed to have killed like 18VC's, and been attempted somewhere around 7 times (this on a level 18 wizard of yours, also currently jailed). Also 17 or something VC's apparently law reported you for something. In fact, none of those numbers were true, it was just some lameass lies, just like whatever shit you are trying to pull here is as well.
I bet that if you didn't have said shit char, and Goomboo, and used both of these characters to harass other players, that I would be able to one day respect you (oh if you quit your hypocricy and lies as well, throw in the botting and bug abuse while you're at it).
I could understand Aule giving you another chance (as he clearly doesn't all all of the above mentioned things), and so he did. And now you used it to bot with another alt of yours *shrug*. If you don't get nuked something is very wrong with this game, so I will just hope for justice to be shown to one of this mud's most detrimental players.
But yeah, continue to pull shit out of your ass and make up lies. I am sure there is still someone that you can reach through too with that shit.
Everyone knows he's full of shit :P It's only a matter of time before he gets caught and nuked.
No. Dakar is not me.
Something interesting to note though is this - From Dakar's log
Below a low cliff(n, w and stairs)
-stair-loth, stair-riv, stair-ado, stair-moria, stair-redhorn, stair-point
Crosis Laurekal the sindar Wolf Spirit (Angelic)
Crosis leaves west.
And this from my client:
say Below a low cliff
You say in Westron: Below a low cliff
-stair-loth, stair-riv, stair-ado, stair-moria, stair-redhorn, stair-point
So yeah, I took everything he had to offer :)
Delkin, you are claiming that you are Dakar, and that Dighi is another guy?
Panayoti: 'I --really-- think you're mistaken, since that character is ---MY---alt., and i'll get him out of Mirkwood some day:P...Yes, I did lend him to you and told you you can use him anytime you want, but he's still not yours:D...OOPS, DID I SAY THAT OUT LOUD? Rolling Eyes Razz ...my bad:P'
Hey, you know what'd be fun? To see Manni try to spin this. Manni, would you please?
Date: 20. Mar, 2008, 18:51:48 By: Jaron
Keep going [Haarni], I'd probably try to sidetrack too if I got exposed like that.
Whatever you say Dighi!:)
The dates apply to when the file was actually changed. I just downloaded his client again and I'm seeing that it was created March 20th, 2008. Also, his website changed so the pieces of the client all have different dates by when they were last modified. I'm looking at something modified 8/25/2003 at 12:08 right now.
So that file with all the working/blocking IP adresses was added on 11th August 2005, if you 4 year story holds true. Thats within your 'control' of the client.
For all your bullshit, we have the facts.
Also, if you go into the notes section, you can see the username as well as 2 additional proxies for Dighi's alts. Also, if you browse the MUSHclient folder, you can see logs of Dighi from 5 years ago.
If you have a gun, are you guilty of murder? Everyone who is looking at this right now has a gun in their hands. What is your point, Haarni?
Everyone who downloaded Delkins client, let me take you on a little tour + lesson.
If you go to File > World Properties (Alt + Enter)
Look at the boxes under 'Proxy Server', you can clearly see he has been logging in from the IP address '70.25.153.149' from port '1028'. Obviously disabled so it does not appear he is multiplaying with every newbie he gives his client too, by selecting Socks 4 or 5, the client will log him on to The Two Towers under a hidden IP. (The way I got around my hardban).
That's the question I have been asking myself lately when I've been dealing with your kind. How does one answer blind ignorance and relentless hypocrisy? You don't. And I won't. Not anymore at least. I posted what I had to post, I'm done, have fun.
How do you answer blind ignorance, Jaron?
Keep going Delkin, I'd probably try to sidetrack too if I got exposed like that.
Uhh, did I bypass a hardban? No.
Also Delkin, i love how you are handign around a client with a proxy server. That was the main reason for my nuke, for bypassing the hardban, which is exactly what you are doing!
Of course it's mine - I'm the person who uploaded it to durmanhoth.com.
'As far as I'm concerned it is an online website and not a guild's board, which is not mentioned on the rules, and considering the site has a hell lot of content that conflict with t2t's rules and prove its outright breaches and a hell lot of information that you have no right to, I don't see a problem. You sound like a fraud firm's owner that screams at the police 'You have got no right!' during a dawn raid.'
Yeah, you're wrong there - You don't have any right to the information on our board. You're in clear violation of rule 6.
6. Guild info
It is forbidden to post directins to any guildhall or to post any guild's memberlist. You are also not allowed to post descriptions of a guild's rooms or posts from its boards without the approval of its Guildmaster.
Vermond, where are you? Could I post secret things from the BkD message board located on their website?
Haarni, you weren't one of the people I was referring to as being ignorant.
Yeah, of course you 'can't find the alt list'.
As far as I'm concerned it is an online website and not a guild's board, which is not mentioned on the rules, and considering the site has a hell lot of content that conflict with t2t's rules and prove its outright breaches and a hell lot of information that you have no right to, I don't see a problem. You sound like a fraud firm's owner that screams at the police 'You have got no right!' during a dawn raid.
About the client, it is obvious that it is Dighi's, and you introduced it for download saying it is yours. That's my conclusion.
Delkin, your client aint all that great. It just proves you can't play without having aliases for every possible outcome, and a bunch of ugly colourtells.
6. Guild info
It is forbidden to post directins to any guildhall or to post any guild's memberlist. You are also not allowed to post descriptions of a guild's rooms or posts from its boards without the approval of its Guildmaster.
http://logs.dyndns.dk/rules.php
Reach a conclusion here, Jaron :p
You're just posting information which you have no right to as well as revealing an alt on THIS page which was meant for a different group of people.
'this was the exact link'
-I can't find it.
Yeah, I posted my current client. I added to it for 4 years. What's your point? Right now I'd guess there are 10 or 20 people using this client. I've already seen several logs posted using my client. I say my client because yes, it is my client - I have added to the point where this is 90% more mine than his. Dighi's client had maybe 1/5 of the stuff mine does now. My current client size is 18.8 megabytes. The initial file was something like 4.
And these are two posts from Delkin that just show what kind of person he is. He was applauded for his political knowledge by his guildmates for his post, let's all be proud of him now:
Delkin
Joined: 06 Jun 2007
Posts: 140
PostPosted Post subject Reply with quoteFind all posts by Delkin
Ok, here we go. Let me start out by telling about Goomboo and why we got out of this war as soon as possible.
Goomboo was me. With Goomboo and my level 5 alt, I, as well as two others showed the game that BKD is made of a weak playerbase with very little skills. With a total of 15 or so kills and a virtual decimation of every active BKD in the space of two or three days, it was quite obvious how weak BKD is. **a little tidbit: my level 5 alt got warned for this: 08/27/07 01:18 : too many murder/murder attempts on mongwen** Razz
Now, that being said, once BKD got a whisper that the characters were alts of Durmanhoth, they stirred up the war engine and started 5 manning us. That is strength of our long-time rival. Let me give you some facts about BKD:
-BKD can survive a worst-case scenario war for 2.92 years.
-BKD makes up for their weak playerbase by their ability to 'absorb' damage...because of their quantity of members, they lose as many as we can kill and still are ready to fight.
-BKD has a large network of alliances..I'll talk about this in a second.
Ok...history lesson. In the past, Durmanhoth has been virtually annihilated in a series of wars which have been dubbed 'The Alliance Wars.'
-First Alliance Wars: Deadlok and G-unit bang randomly and kill many many people. Nearly every guild in Arda as well as several clans ally against Durmanhoth and nearly drives us to extinction.
-Second Alliance Wars: Amearn, Dakar, Slugz, and Bartoss have the motto 'who free = who enemy' and began systematically killing level 20's who have a certain color in their legendinfo that they don't like. Roughly 9 guilds go to war with us. We are nearly destroyed.
-Manni takes over the guild at the end of this period and leads us to heights we haven't seen in many years.
In the politics of Arda, it is common knowledge that if any of the core moral guilds go to war, the other core moral guilds will follow suit. For instance, if you declare war on Valacirca, BKD will declare war on you...there are a very exceptions to this, but that is as things stand these days. If we were to prolong this war with BKD, they would eventually call on their allies...this leads to bad bad things. I, as well as the other senior members of this guild, have been through an alliance war. Sitting in your guildhall at 3 day uptime with elven chainmail and a jeweled dagger is really not that fun. Leaving to go grab a skull helmet and getting 7 manned isn't that fun either Razz. Manni knows all this and got us out of it as soon as possible and without a single scratch on our reputation. For the observant, a third Alliance War was in the process:
Date: 04. Sep, 2007, 6:07:48 By: Ulfanil
Yeah. I'm sensing alot of guild will be against Durms.
Now down to the tangibles. I believe that we need to have 2 million gold by the middle of the year and 3.5 million by the middle of 2008. To beat our enemies, we have to use their strategies. When Udungul falls in a month or so, that will be massive propaganda in our favor. A guild declared war on us...we killed them.
Also, as soon as we are completely free of the threat of hostilities, I will begin organizing (with administrative approval) the combat/competition of teams. These teams will be 3-5 members each. In these teams, you will have 1 reboot to compete with the other team. The competition will be based on:
1. Amount of gear gathered by the end of the boot (this gear will be stored in 'huge boxes' rented from innrooms)
2. The amount of 'kills' a team gets (mercifuls)
3. Amount of gold deposited in a bank (team will gold and fill up a few personal bank accounts)
Following each competition, a winner will be announced as well as statistics posted. For the following reboot, all the participants will work together and learn huntbreaks, how something was done, tricks involved, methods. These competitions will continue at irregular intervals to train the guild as a whole under warfare conditions.
Delkin
Joined: 06 Jun 2007
Posts: 140
PostPosted Post subject Reply with quoteFind all posts by Delkin
The thing is, after reading Klardin's comment:
'I'd rather die on my feet then live on my knees.'
I sympathize with Jared and the likes. However, this is one that I believe if we shrug it off, we will rebound higher than ever before. Durmanhoth was not shamed, we used alts as a shield against a huge war.
Another history lesson: A few of us older Durms remember the Aina Amarth war that lasted a few months. Armand ordered that Deadlok be executed and pay gold and write a gossiper. Deadlok, as well as the guild, said we would rather die than meet those terms. We fought that war to the bloody end (when people were just like meh, screw it) Razz...
So, next founded war that arises...we will fight it to whatever end. As has been shown...we have people in Durmanhoth who would happily destroy characters for the guild. This 'war' was unfounded and we needed to take the necessary actions to preserve the integrity of the guild.
And I suicided Goomboo by offering to do it...the character was an exploration character for me...that means that I test things out...like right before I went out, I was going to nightshade myself to get in-depth statistics on how deaths work...instead I got manni to kill me 20 times or so...pk deaths take 20-25% of your EXP and you nearly always lose exactly 1 average stat.
/_____//_____//_____/__
Since you guys know that a password was compromised, I might as well let you know that I was one of the numerous people that was looking around in your websites. I saved some stuff, so I might just post it here since Tulkas won't do anything here.
You are not Dighi? Great. These are quotes from you.
'Delkin
Joined: 06 Jun 2007
Posts: 140
PostPosted Post subject Reply with quoteFind all posts by Delkin
If you'd like, here are all my triggers, aliases...ok, here's my client Smile
http://durmanhoth.com/mush.zip
just unload the zip, go into the mushclient folder, and open the world 't2t'...it'll automatically load triggers/aliases/everything. You know it works if you see this when you go to Linhir signpost...
<<HP:230 EP:230>> SG Linhir(w, s, city and n) [se, sw, e, ne and s]
-linb (Hill - 50 HP) , linb2 (boards), durmgh
-linld (SSS)
-lin-cal, lin-mt, lin-dol, lin-pela, lin-len, lin-coast, lin-neth, lin-seth, lin-village, linheal
A signpost
A hitching post'
'
Delkin
Joined: 06 Jun 2007
Posts: 140
PostPosted Post subject Reply with quoteFind all posts by Delkin
that is my client...that is what you see me typing on/playing on/everything
that has counterbreaks
4 hunbreaks/town
everything
I made small modifications to it nearly every day, but that is the product of 4 years of 'small modifications' Razz
If you are using it and need an update, let me know and I'll help you out
Guest apperances from Cormaic and Smoky:
'my god thank you!!!
never expected to be like that.'
'I get a 404 on the link. SMoky want client!!'
Also, uhm, the client comes with some timers with one page long freebie aliases which I won't share here. Guess that's what you were doing when you got nuked. It also has logs of Dighi killing newbies, logs of him making new alts and spreading his QI site.. and a list of IPs under the headlines 'banned' and 'good'. Of course the client is removed now, but not before several people downloaded a copy.
'The Durmanhoth website does not have alt lists.'
Actually, there's a whole section for espionage and alt lists.
I will not post the list itself for obvious reasons, but this was the exact link 'http://t2tquests.com/index.php?title=Category:Alt_Information' The list involves names of ainur as well, and there's a discussion topic about Luthien's alts in the forum. Thought that was still illegal.
Oh, and here is a golden one from Panayoti:
panayoti
Joined: 04 Jun 2007
Posts: 105
PostPosted Post subject Reply with quoteFind all posts by panayoti
Eigen:P...?...???...!!!???....I --really-- think you're mistaken, since that character is ---MY---alt., and i'll get him out of Mirkwood some day:P...Yes, I did lend him to you and told you you can use him anytime you want, but he's still not yours:D...OOPS, DID I SAY THAT OUT LOUD? Rolling Eyes Razz ...my bad:P
/_____//_____//_____/__
Of course I must be making all these up, considering I'm delirious and Durms never lie.
Removed the comments about Delkin's alts - I had kept it earlier because I thought I saw some of the people in the lists online at the same time and figured Haarni got it wrong.
Not everyone is at the same level of intelligence as the majority of your guild and Valinor. You are full of so much bullshit, franky I don't care anymore and nor should you. Unless you want to max a new character we are history!
Dighi's client is freely available at his website. It is not against T2T rules to add your aliases to his much more developed client.
So the logs contained in the file you used to be able to download (which myself and lots of other people have) from your website that show Dighi in action are merely lies? And the .txt file with the list of banned IPs? Its obvious you are Dighi:P
The Durmanhoth website does not have alt lists. The Durmanhoth website is not public information. The Durmanhoth website requires a guild username as well as password. To access it, you must hack our website or use an account which you are not authorized to use.
I think its also illegal to have an 'alt list' on your public website is it not?
If I were Dighi, wouldn't I remove the QI site to save my hide?
I think that is sort of void when they are about to be nuked for cheating. They are both still jailed are they not, Dighi?
I think its for things like:
If you go a little west from Bree signpost there a cave, theres a wizard in there that needs some help!!!
not...
do 4w,n,5w,search grass,cave,aid wizard,push rock,crawl passage,kill lizard (watch out he locks you so bring healing) once dead do get fang from corpse,out,give fang to wizard,tell wizard DOMECHECKED SCRUB!!!!!!,loosen rack,wield 1337 sword,out,10e,4n,10w,54e,$im lost near bree someone help
There's a freaking wiki on t2tmud.org for posting quest info. Everyone's just too selfish to post anything there.
Haarni 'accidently' left his bot on. :( EQUAL PUNISHMENTS!!!
And Manni, if you still believe that it is legal after my comment, I propose that you put the link in your legendinfo.
The QI site is not legal because:
1- Only private links are legal, it is not password-protected, thus not private
2- It advocates newbie killing.
Hosted by Putin then? Interesting.
And could the tick timer Delkin left on by 'accident' be a several lines long freebie quest alias? ;)
Oh, Manni, really?:))) I was trying to tell this to Tulkas too...
The QI site is a) legal by current MUD rules and b) hosted by a Bulgarian.
I contacted someone who was able to remove the newbie killing link, but I guess someone else put it back up. I'll try to get that deleted again ASAP.
For the record I don't agree with gold being more easy to come by, if anything everyone has got too rich. I remeber when I was starting out there would be 4/5 level 20's on - no more. If you died, you'd have to spend a day to two releveling, not a few hours.
Nor do I, but Tevildo you think I stumbled upon T2T in a Lord of the Rings google search 7 years ago, logged on, and maxxed in 3 RL days? It took me a year to reach level 11:P I explored all those newbie quests, I enjoyed them. So your saying for each character I have to explore quests I already know exist, I wanted to max out as soon as possible to play with my friends I left behind when I was nuked.
In answer to Curr's remarks about golding...
There's no real reason why it should be possible to max a character in 24 hours, or 48 or 72. There are two main epochs of every character: the struggle to get to level 19/20, and then the endgame period of casually maintaining that. A long-term player is going to spend most of their time in the second phase anyway; why should everyone be rushed and pushed and heaved toward it? As a newbiehelper I would feel like I screwed up if I urged someone into levelling past the point where they're going to explore the small towns, do newbie quests that they'll never have access to again, maybe join a clan...
We have whole groups of typists who are surprisingly ignorant of the game. They've mostly done the same relatively few quests as everyone else: the economical ones. Partly it's their own fault for having no curiosity and being satisfied with other people's information; partly it's the fault of the people who gave them aliases rather than hints and QI rather than advice; and of course it's largely the result of horrible balancing. There's no game-design reason that golding should be boring, or should even be distinguishable from other activities. And there are numerous arguments against having it be this way. Super-golding encourages and rewards certain races and alignments over others and lowers character investment--making nuking an ineffective punishment.
I just don't see what's gained by having easily-farmed or easily-botted gold.
If he has matured, why does he keep hosting his qi site?
Hey, is there a MUD NCAA tournament bracket challenge going on anywhere?
Manni said: 'I think Delkin's matured. At this point he certainly doesn't embody the same habitual nature of cheating that warrants multiple characters being nuked, let alone a hard ban.'
But all the time he has been playing while under a hardban, you warrant that too? I'm not saying nuke him, im just saying if your doing do it to one person, do it to them all!
Haarni was nuked for botting. Arkhar was just golding when Durms killed him, only so many hits you can take of Mels at level 13 though. So yeah, I lost three characters because of ones actions. And I didn't tell anyone to fuck off, Tulkas nuked me on suprisingly good terms, hence me choosing my own nuke reason.
He then randomly decided to hardban me a few days later.
Haarni, Arkhar was nuked for botting without punishment to your other characters. It was when you botted with Haarni the next day, then told all the ainur to fuck off that put you in a bad spot. Delkin probably left a tick timer on by accident and that's the first time he's done anything against the rules in years. People tend to mature as they get older, especially through high school and college. I think Delkin's matured. At this point he certainly doesn't embody the same habitual nature of cheating that warrants multiple characters being nuked, let alone a hard ban.
I missed out the point of that previous post....
Valinor for some unknown reason aren't nuking certain cheaters so they target people like me because noone will really drum up a fuss about it, and it looks like they are 'flushing out' the evil cheating peoples of T2T. I'll take those 40+ bug reports I made of Far Harad back then! And those 12 or so Adventurers Tome entries that were never put in!!!!
Yeah, he was trying to keep Grahk legit, too bad that one was nuked.
Really, Falgor isn't annoying. He was also a good newbie helper, one of the very few for ERs. And Skyman's tellhist.
But anyways.. about Falgor, he definitely should've been given another chance. I could name a LOT of other people who are more deserving for a nuke. I used to not like this kid just because we met on bad terms and whatnot but he's a pretty good guy and should by no means be hardbanned right now if there are certain others playing freely
I RP so fucking good that my character has a mind of its own. And it just so happens he likes to gold and makes monies so he does it all the time. Or maybe I got so into character that even when I'm not at the computer, I'm still a part of him so I'm not botting.. Or not. *is bored
Raising the gold cap in areas you're in good standing in would be fun. If it's only a slight boost, anyway.
No, that's exactly what I'm saying. I'm not saying it is a person. So what does it matter how it gets gold?
The character isn't a person Orcoron. That's a moronic argument.
No no Foraker. The CHARACTER spends the time and boring effort. The only difference being the human isn't bored out of his mind.
One person spending countless hours designing a bot doesn't give the right to the rest of the dur, I mean 20 people using it to not have to do any work for it. And if you import the settings how can an ainur tell which bot a person is using or if they made it themselves?:) Although, granted, an ainur could ask for the files for it and with little knowledge of it quiz the person using it but then again they could have their friend on AIM. So thats too complicated. Seriously though, if you take the time to make gold and actually put effort into a character (one or many), you will appreciate the end results in the way that the makers of the game were hoping. In an age where instant seems to be expected (instead of appreciated), this game is one place that used to be a haven from it.
What about spending countless hours designing your bot? Isn't that worth the time and effort spent?
Easy solution: PK the botters. If they aren't at the keyboard it'd be rather obvious hmm?
Uh if you're botting you don't have to be at the computer. So in terms of your play time, its free gold. You didn't put in any 'time or effort.' It most certainly is an advantage. You can't say, well if I couldn't bot I WOULD have spent that time golding so its fair. Well I could have an ainur automatically max my alt, but if I had to I WOULD have spent my time leveling it myself. Equally fair?!
Well, not exactly true Foraker. Kinda true, yes. But if you're botting the character still goes through the time and effort of getting the gold, you're just not bored out of your mind while it happens. So the unfair advantage is that the person not botting is bored out of their fucking skull, while you're happily spending your time doing something else. It's not really a game mechanics disadvantage.
If I told you my alts pallasch, I would have to kill you!
Little tip: Next time I ask you who you are and why you applied to my guild, you'd be better served just telling me who you are :)
Making gold easier to get isn't as simple as letting you level faster. If people got gold faster, pkers could kill more (fines would be easier to pay), people could relevel faster, making death mean even less; more people would keep up and max secondaries, making it (more of) an expected part of being a maxed character. People would make more alts, making the population more spread out among guilds and clans (easy to max chars, have one in every guild). More guilds would appear, as easy gold would make it easier to buy and maintain a guild, etc, etc.
Now, maybe leveling should be easier. I don't have a ton of alts, but I've leveled a couple and I get really bored doing it. Particularly around level 12-16. So maybe they should make those stats cheaper or something. But on the other hand, there are apparently lots of people who can max a char in 24h (usually with help I'm sure but still). Do we want to make it even easier?
As for botting, it has the same effect as any easier way of getting gold. It's getting an unfair advantage over other players. The only way it doesn't affect others players is if you never interact (particularly with PK) with other characters, which I'm sure Haarni would. So should he be nuked for botting? Definitely. Should he be hardbanned? If he's consistent about doing it, maybe. Or at least he shouldn't be given the doubt anymore (always snoop logged?). We don't need more cheaters.
Curr brings up great points, but... eh, I dunno. If gold were that much easier to obtain, I think the people who'd benefit most are the pkers. Easier to gold for fines, easier to retrain stats when you die. So we'd probably see a lot more rampant pk.
As boring as golding is, it does provide a sense of steadiness to things. If you raise the amount of gold that can be made per amount of effort, you'd have to fiddle with a lot of things, such as raising fine caps, looking at guild rents, etc.
The people who bot to make gold are the unsavoury elements, I think. The ones who 'can't be fucked' putting in the time and the effort to play the game straight, so they resort to cheating. This plays into their hands.
And then again, they could just as easily farm mirkwood using their bots, too. :)
Golding isn't hard at all if you know what you're doing. And if you find it boring, just get a group of friends together and gold to make it more interesting.
That curr, was not nearly as true back when they had no penalty for questing and killing in areas. Now with the sell after killing issues or before where you couldn't use the town or get blocked, it definitely makes making gold far more difficult. The problem you are bringing up is a very good one, but I think the problem isn't only in the fact that making gold is boring, but only certain types of play patterns will produce good amount of golds. I think one of the single biggest issues is with shopkeepers only giving back 100 gold per sell. This actually really hurts newer players more because they often kill something for gold/resources that ends up taking more effort to kill than they make selling to a shop. Now, obviously I am not saying blow the cap off, but maybe a rebalance and raise of that cap a little bit would at least help.
Pounder.
So, I really don't understand why golding in this game has to be so insanely time-intensive.
You can say 'balance', but it doesn't really mean anything. The balance has to be chosen, and the one ainur chose and stick with encourages people to spend ungodly amounts of time on the game doing the most boring things imaginable. And I don't understand - why? I can understand why WoW encourages grinding - their business model depends on people not getting the valued eq too quickly. But we don't pay a subscription to t2t. And nobody comes here just in order to gold and fill their banks (the obvious exception excepted). Nobody enjoys that crap. People enjoy socializing, PKing, exploring, Mordor, whatever, but not golding.
I mean, suppose ainur put huge amounts of grid mons all over Mirkwood tomorrow, each of them equal to a Linhir guard in difficulty and gold. And let them respawn all the time. What's the *bad* thing that would happen? So gold would be very easy to come by, so what? People would focus on the things they like doing and not on the boring crap. People would enjoy the game more, what's the downside? Maybe some inflation at Alexa, and easier to recover from deaths but that's already easy.
Or look at maxing a character. Damn. Suppose I want to start playing again, start over. I can't come up with 2-4 days of time spent on the mud that easily. That's a *huge* amount of time. Maybe not to someone who's in high school and can spend 8 hours per day or twice that on a summer break (no offense, do whatever you like), but other people have jobs, families etc. The time investment I need to get to the point where the game starts to shine is insane, so I won't even start, can't afford to. And the stupidest thing about it all is that there's no *reason* for it to be that way. And even if you can find the time to max 4 alts, wouldn't you like to do something more interesting during all those boring hours? I've never botted, but I can't really blame anyone who is. Nobody should be forced to endure so much boredom.
So... I don't get it. Ainur? Are you listening? Balance isn't sacred. Experiment with it! There's no reason for the game to act as evil suckage of time (boring=evil). If you disagree and like the way it is now, explain to me why.
OK, done whining.
:(
Peace man, fun playing with you.
Stay safe, Mark.
For one, I REALLY HOPE THAT OSSE'S TELL IS FAKE. That is a complete and utter lie which I know for a fact, they have NEVER allowed people to make gold off bugs and keep that gold (if not impose harsh punishments if it looks intentional). In fact people have been punished for just ACCEPTING that gold. Its pretty sad because I know for a fact Haarni wasn't botting last night, he was the only er to 'harass' me for killing in mordor. He was having fun killing pit creatures and I even helped him get a mirrored sword because he was fun to talk to. In all honesty, I am starting to get this feeling that I am very delusional with the fact that I believe that the ainur are trying to turn things around. There is a major key that is required when trying to turn a place from a f/muck pot into something of decent reputation. Its called having good and FAIR judgement (looking at intent to harm players, how they treat other players, whether they uphold any grace or style, whether they show reasonable judgement themselves). Its not based on whether someone can smooth talk really well when they are supposed to be punished. All I see them doing is promoting and protecting (from punishment -> see panayoti) people who think its fun to go around Arda pretending like they are gangsters or hoodlums(SP?) operating without respect for hard work and other types of playstyles. Obviously I am seeing a slant on these pages, but it really really is looking worse and worse each day from the various things posted here. And more gangster shit here will just make new players in arda behave like that because its the 'norm'. Done with my rant, continue. :)
Grahk snarls and braces himself.
HP:230 EP:230
A bolt of lightning descends from the heavens, and all goes dark.
Osse should kudo him before nuking, that was cute.
Cya back in a few months Mark.
Meh, they're idiots. So what if a guy bots? Golding is the single most boring fucking aspect of the game. Did his botting hurt anyone? Also it's legal under some pretty broad conditions.
From my understanding the only reason he got busted was because he fell asleep and forgot to turn it off.
And only then because the hypocritical fucks that A: Bot themselves and B: hand out a client with a built in bot to their guild members and C: Host that client on a questinfo/altinfo site reported him.
Not that I have a huge moral objection to them doing it, but double standards are bullshit and that any rules in this game are made up on the spot or whatever they feel like enforcing depending on who they can enforce it against is equally, bullshit.
Every person they ban is just another person not playing their game.
Anyways, see you Mark! I hope the army does you some good.
Heh, don't blame Osse, hes a cool guy. Command to nuke me came from the big A!
You told Osse: it doesnt look right to me that you let mute
simultaneously play his 4 alts, you let kvedulf go to level 23
through bug (with gold made from botting), and yet you hardban
falgor?!
Osse told you: We have a long-standing tradition with levels that if
someone figures out a way, they get to keep it. As for Mute, the
second we can actually PROVE some of these claims, he's toast.
You told Osse: its what police in my country used to do - jail a poor
weed-smoking student for 5years because they caught him with one dose
of weed
You told Osse: what, you didnt see kvedulf's log of getting killed
while botting?
Osse told you: I'm not th epower of law.
You told Osse: you're a power, tho. i'll keep whining unless someone
nukes the guys who've been abusing the game and harming people for
months
You told Osse: there are ways to proof-check if someones simultaneously
playing 4 alts, i bet!
For the record I botted on one alt, Falgor never botted in his life. He was just nuked for his alts actions.